artsrc[OP]2 points · Apr 2026 · :flag_nsw: New South Welshian
What do you mean by full employment?
As mentioned in the article, Australia had unemployment below 2% during WWII, and for the next couple of decades, with long term unemployment extremely rare. This was driven by a different approach to macro economic policy.
Full employment = frictional + structural unemployment
(obviously countries can have "full employment" so I disagree with the poster)
If you look those up you'll see why lower natural rate of unemployment isn't necessarily a good sign for the economy. Hint: it's easier to employ a low-skilled workforce
The guy replying to you is right. Having significant “structural” unemployment is a bad thing for the economy, but “frictional” unemployment is always going to be there and represents people moving between jobs or entering the job search.
Russia having low unemployment isn’t a great measure because all it is actually highlighting is 1. No one wants to lose their job in Russia so if they get one they hold onto it for dear life and 2. If they lose their job or don’t have a job they don’t look for employment because they know they can’t get it (ie they exit the workforce). 3. The jobs are more low tech, labour intensive work, so it is easy enough to swap one person out for any other because they need limited knowledge or training (and I think 4. probably also applies too - wtf would you trust Russia on economic statistics?)
Of course Australia had low unemployment post war - they had massive public works program designed for everyone to “pitch in” so there was an element of duty in being employed even though you would have been doing something no one would put up with now like digging ditches and the like. Again, it’s not representative of good things, quite the opposite, it’s a function of low paying, low skill jobs prevailing significantly and a lack of choice for employees (employees with no choice don’t leave jobs).
Unemployment below the NAIRU indicates lots of likely skills shortages and gaps, so it’s not good for productivity and technology advancement, and while pushing up labour force competitiveness is a good thing, it also likely indicates more people are working significant overtime, the need for importing significant labour from overseas is higher, and also a likelihood prices are going up at a speed faster than wages.
It’s good to have a frictional rate that’s higher as it indicates choice and higher educated, more technical jobs
artsrc[OP]1 points · Apr 2026 · :flag_nsw: New South Welshian
Russia having low unemployment isn’t a great measure because all it is actually highlighting ..
if they lose their job or don’t have a job they don’t look for employment because they know they can’t get it (ie they exit the workforce).
All the things you describe would have been the case before the war.
Your view is inconsistent with the change in unemployment statistics since the Ukraine war.
My view is that it relates to the large number of working age people who left, the large numbers are fighting in a war, the massive work of import substitution work from sanctions, and the massive fiscal stimulus, building weapons, and paying for a large army.
My view is consistent with the facts, the change in unemployment in Russia.
artsrc[OP]0 points · Apr 2026 · :flag_nsw: New South Welshian
“frictional” unemployment ... represents people moving between jobs or entering the job search.
Agreed.
Words are tools for communication, and their most important meanings are what is intended by the person who says them, and what is understood by the person hearing them.
In a world with advanced computer systems, zoom, telecommunications, etc. I see no reason for frictional unemployment
This just shows you have no idea what frictional employment actually is. All the things you’ve highlighted created greater flexibility, wider work arrangements and greater choice to move between employers and take longer time off — all of which lead to much more frictional unemployment, not less
An economy isn't just distribution... it's efficient distribution, or more precisely efficient allocation of scarce resources to their most productive uses. We use price as an imperfect proxy for productivity. Full employment is where the market clears: every unit of labour willing to work at offered prices (equilibrium price, where supply and demand curves meet) is matched, minus the structural and frictional barriers.
With that out of the way
Pushing unemployment below full employment (the NAIRU) forces employers to compete for a depleted labor pool. This drives up wages without increasing productivity, and employers' fiduciary passes increased labor costs onto the consumer. Higher prices force workers to demand higher wages, triggering a wage-price spiral and runaway inflation. There are social arguments for riding closer to NAIRU, but they're not economic arguments. Inflation hurts everyone long-term.
Also, an advancing economy expects some structural unemployment because of creative destruction. When Australian industries innovate, old skillsets become obsolete. Look at the Pilbara, where driverless haul trucks have displaced traditional drivers but created a massive shortage of remote robotics technicians. Or look at IT infra moving to the cloud. We no longer need server techs in-house, and cloud economies of scale minimizes the demand for server techs. It takes time to reskill those redundant workers for the new, specialized jobs. An economy with zero structural unemployment has stopped advancing
Europe has ways to fast track reskilling, so their structural unemployment is lower than ours, so I think Australia should copy their policies. But that is irrelevant to this conversation, and to Russia's low unemployment, which is driven by military conscription, brain drain, and an unproductive consumption-based war economy - not good for the long term health of their economy. If the war machine produced infrastructure instead of missiles and drones with a small unproductive lifespan then it'd be a different story.
No country has full employment
artsrc [OP] 2 points · Apr 2026 · :flag_nsw: New South Welshian
What do you mean by full employment?
As mentioned in the article, Australia had unemployment below 2% during WWII, and for the next couple of decades, with long term unemployment extremely rare. This was driven by a different approach to macro economic policy.
Russia currently has quite low unemployment:
https://www.ceicdata.com/en/indicator/russia/unemployment-rate
ALLIRIX 2 points · Apr 2026 · :flag_qld: Queenslander
Full employment = frictional + structural unemployment
(obviously countries can have "full employment" so I disagree with the poster)
If you look those up you'll see why lower natural rate of unemployment isn't necessarily a good sign for the economy. Hint: it's easier to employ a low-skilled workforce
artsrc [OP] 0 points · Apr 2026 · :flag_nsw: New South Welshian
I find your language “not a good sign for the economy” curious.
The purpose of an economy is the delivery and distribution of goods and services.
Unemployment in Australia results in a deficiency in the distribution of goods and services.
damnumalone 1 points · Apr 2026 · :flag_qld: Queenslander
The guy replying to you is right. Having significant “structural” unemployment is a bad thing for the economy, but “frictional” unemployment is always going to be there and represents people moving between jobs or entering the job search.
Russia having low unemployment isn’t a great measure because all it is actually highlighting is 1. No one wants to lose their job in Russia so if they get one they hold onto it for dear life and 2. If they lose their job or don’t have a job they don’t look for employment because they know they can’t get it (ie they exit the workforce). 3. The jobs are more low tech, labour intensive work, so it is easy enough to swap one person out for any other because they need limited knowledge or training (and I think 4. probably also applies too - wtf would you trust Russia on economic statistics?)
Of course Australia had low unemployment post war - they had massive public works program designed for everyone to “pitch in” so there was an element of duty in being employed even though you would have been doing something no one would put up with now like digging ditches and the like. Again, it’s not representative of good things, quite the opposite, it’s a function of low paying, low skill jobs prevailing significantly and a lack of choice for employees (employees with no choice don’t leave jobs).
Unemployment below the NAIRU indicates lots of likely skills shortages and gaps, so it’s not good for productivity and technology advancement, and while pushing up labour force competitiveness is a good thing, it also likely indicates more people are working significant overtime, the need for importing significant labour from overseas is higher, and also a likelihood prices are going up at a speed faster than wages.
It’s good to have a frictional rate that’s higher as it indicates choice and higher educated, more technical jobs
artsrc [OP] 1 points · Apr 2026 · :flag_nsw: New South Welshian
All the things you describe would have been the case before the war.
Your view is inconsistent with the change in unemployment statistics since the Ukraine war.
My view is that it relates to the large number of working age people who left, the large numbers are fighting in a war, the massive work of import substitution work from sanctions, and the massive fiscal stimulus, building weapons, and paying for a large army.
My view is consistent with the facts, the change in unemployment in Russia.
artsrc [OP] 1 points · Apr 2026 · :flag_nsw: New South Welshian
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Structural_unemployment
My reading is that u/ALLIRIX in the comment https://www.reddit.com/r/OpenAussie/comments/1sq5pnz/comment/oh5q9hg/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button is saying that complex, sophisticated economies have structural unemployment because they have demand for specialized skills that are likely to have a mismatch between skills and jobs.
So that having structural unemployment is, in his view, indicative of a good kind of economy.
Where as, say a medieval economy, where most people are a farm laborers, don't have structural employment because everyone has the same skills.
artsrc [OP] 0 points · Apr 2026 · :flag_nsw: New South Welshian
Agreed.
Words are tools for communication, and their most important meanings are what is intended by the person who says them, and what is understood by the person hearing them.
Your understanding, and the intent of the commenter is consistent with the wikipedia discussion - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frictional_unemployment
In a world with advanced computer systems, zoom, telecommunications, etc. I see no reason for frictional unemployment.
Other solutions to frictional unemployment - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Job_guarantee , have also been proposed.
damnumalone 0 points · Apr 2026 · :flag_qld: Queenslander
This just shows you have no idea what frictional employment actually is. All the things you’ve highlighted created greater flexibility, wider work arrangements and greater choice to move between employers and take longer time off — all of which lead to much more frictional unemployment, not less
ALLIRIX 0 points · Apr 2026 · :flag_qld: Queenslander
An economy isn't just distribution... it's efficient distribution, or more precisely efficient allocation of scarce resources to their most productive uses. We use price as an imperfect proxy for productivity. Full employment is where the market clears: every unit of labour willing to work at offered prices (equilibrium price, where supply and demand curves meet) is matched, minus the structural and frictional barriers.
With that out of the way
Pushing unemployment below full employment (the NAIRU) forces employers to compete for a depleted labor pool. This drives up wages without increasing productivity, and employers' fiduciary passes increased labor costs onto the consumer. Higher prices force workers to demand higher wages, triggering a wage-price spiral and runaway inflation. There are social arguments for riding closer to NAIRU, but they're not economic arguments. Inflation hurts everyone long-term.
Also, an advancing economy expects some structural unemployment because of creative destruction. When Australian industries innovate, old skillsets become obsolete. Look at the Pilbara, where driverless haul trucks have displaced traditional drivers but created a massive shortage of remote robotics technicians. Or look at IT infra moving to the cloud. We no longer need server techs in-house, and cloud economies of scale minimizes the demand for server techs. It takes time to reskill those redundant workers for the new, specialized jobs. An economy with zero structural unemployment has stopped advancing
Europe has ways to fast track reskilling, so their structural unemployment is lower than ours, so I think Australia should copy their policies. But that is irrelevant to this conversation, and to Russia's low unemployment, which is driven by military conscription, brain drain, and an unproductive consumption-based war economy - not good for the long term health of their economy. If the war machine produced infrastructure instead of missiles and drones with a small unproductive lifespan then it'd be a different story.