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(Spoilers All) For those who were fans during the wait for earlier books

6 points · submitted Nov 2012 by u/rendel · archived

How accurate was the speculation?

It seems like the majority of the community has come to certain conclusions about what will be in TWOW especially the thinking the Jon is coming back.

Was there anything that people "knew" was going to happen but didn't end up happening?

Alternatively was there any speculation that was eerily accurate?

Also how excited were you when finally got a book you had been waiting literally years for?

20 comments · 68% upvoted · other discussions

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busnumberfun 13 points · Nov 2012 · Enter your desired flair text here!

I was convinced Dany and the dragons would finally show up in Westeros since the title was "Dance with Dragons."

ungoogleable 1 points · Nov 2012 · Breathes Shadow Fire

You could still be right. The name was picked before Martin knew he had to write AFFC. Then AFFC went long and pushed out what was originally planned for ADWD. The ADWD we got is basically AFFC volume two.

zerkeras 2 points · Nov 2012 · The Shield that Guards the Realms of Men

Not exactly. It was meant to go ASOS to ADWD but he realized ADWD was too long, and split it up into AFFC and ADWD. With TWOW coming, he's back on track. I would saw it's weird though, ADWD really doesn't sum up the book as well as the other titles do. Unless you count Dany's stuff with Drogo and Quentyn's attempted tomfoolery, but I have a feeling much more interesting dragon stuff is yet to come.

angrybiologist 4 points · Nov 2012 · rawr. rawr. like a dungeon drogon

I think the title fits a little. Remember, we're told a little history of Dance of the Dragons where one Targaryen was set to inherit but another Targaryen was crowned. By the end of the book it looks like it's a set up for history to repeat itself: one Dragon will inherit the throne, but the other Dragon will try to take it

grammar_is_optional 1 points · Nov 2012 · *Grinds teeth*

That's a pretty good catch.

[deleted] 1 points · Nov 2012

Not quite true - He originally planned a three year gap between ASOS and ADWD, realised he didn't want to fuck around with all the exposition, and decided he had to write what happened in that time - leading to the majority of AFFC/ADWD (like, he hadn't planned to add all that Meereen BULLSHIT and that was one of the reasons he spent so long on it). I think the end of ADWD/TWOW will cover what was originally meant to be ADWD.

He has stated in the past (can't remember where, some thus spake martin) that we would see another Dance Of The Dragons in the series (the original DWD was a Civil War between two targaryens), so that'l be Dany vs Aegon then. Who knows though, Dany could be a while off yet. Or, she could be back by halfway through TWOW.

drinking4life 2 points · Nov 2012

Not quite true - he planned a five year gap.

Tankfly_Bosswalk 1 points · Nov 2012 · Flea Bottom girls make the rockin' world

I think ADWD fits very well as a title. It was solving the Meereneese knot that took all that time in the writing; in GRRM's mind this book was about the manoeuvrings (dancing) around Dany to wrest control of the dragons, the occupation of Mereen and the probable invasion force for Westeros. JonCon and Aegon were aiming for that, but peeled away and attacked early instead, the Iron Islanders went that way, Tyrion went that way, and all the myriad political groups of the East trying to shape the region the way they want it.

By of a fudge to spend the whole book dealing with that dance and never actually settle anything, but still...

[deleted] 9 points · Nov 2012

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ToxicMonkeys 3 points · Nov 2012

I guess I must have missed something, I had this theory for myself while reading the books and I never picked up anything that I thought debunked it. Care to enlighten me?

[deleted] 4 points · Nov 2012

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ToxicMonkeys 2 points · Nov 2012

Ah, there goes that theory. Thanks for your answer.

Something tells me Benjen still has some role to play(or perhaps he already played it unbeknownst to us) dead or alive. Otherwise I don't think he would be referenced so much in the books.

life036 0 points · Nov 2012

Killed long ago could mean a few months or a few years. Benjen's been missing for a couple of years now, right?

Also, GRRM's admitted to making minor mistakes before, so that line doesn't seem like it totally precludes the possibility.

ultimatemorky 3 points · Nov 2012

The children of the forest live longer lives than men, a long time to a cotf should be a long tine for men.

Also, a few months should be a long time for something as insignificant as losing your phone, not someones death.

life036 2 points · Nov 2012

The native language of the CotF is the true tongue, but they speak to Bran and the others in the common tongue. It stands to reason that the translation, and therefore the meaning behind the translation, is put into context specific to Bran and the other humans. So when they say "long ago", they mean that relative to the human understanding of long ago.

a few months should be a long time for something as insignificant as losing your phone, not someones death.

Dude wat? Time doesn't change based on what noun you reference. No matter how you want to spin it, time is a constant. If Benjen really did die a few years ago, that qualifies as "long ago".

ultimatemorky 2 points · Nov 2012

That quote made sense to me at the time.

Anyways, my point was that a couple of months to a few years isn't a long time, especially not to the children of the forest.

life036 1 points · Nov 2012

I see your point, however I don't think that the "long ago" line constitutes concrete evidence either way. It doesn't really kill the theory for me like it does for other people.

[deleted] 2 points · Nov 2012

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life036 1 points · Nov 2012

Right, he/she knows what it means to humans.

And not only that, I see "long ago" as more of a constant concept, it doesn't have to be relative to someone's lifespan. Even if I was a thousand years old, if something happened to me a few years ago I'd still consider it "long ago".

bobzor 5 points · Nov 2012

In the previous thread someone mentioned they figured out Arstan was Barristan Selmy. Not game changing or anything, but they got some things right!

megatom0 3 points · Nov 2012 · Dik-Fil-A

I've asked this question before. It seems like the one thing to come true was Arya becoming an assassin of sorts. Most people saw Dany coming to westeros finally, but we all know that didn't happen.

iHeartCoolStuff 3 points · Nov 2012

Going to have to seriously resist the urge to flip through the pages looking for Jon chapters upon purchasing

sammythemc 1 points · Nov 2012 · Umber is the New Black

I made a thread along these lines a few weeks back, here was my favorite answer:

That littlefinger has been in bed with cersei the whole time (metaphorically... i hope). in agot he burns Ned to cersei's benefit and in acok he pulls off the Tyrell alliance and is given harrenhal for his trouble. you wonder if he's been her man the whole time...

until, y'know, the whole "poisoning joffrey" thing.