u/Kuuderia

See, the thing is fan clashes like that often show the most hideous type of fans. I'm in a country-specific ADP GC where most fans are casuals (like not knowing how to vote etc), on average older than typical 5th gen fans, and also tired of the internet discourse. Very few of us joins the int'l GC where the members often do the things you described in the name of "standing up against haters" and think the dayones who don't wanna shit on other fandoms are soft. After a while I just don't care about things I can't control.

In Indonesia, I notice that Youngseo, Woochan and Annie stuff tend to sell faster (or at all) compared to Bailey and Tarzzan.

Even sales among what little core fandom they have dropped, presumably because the fans learned from history and behave as a rational economic agent re: the cut line to get into fansigns. Even if you like an artist and want to go to their fansigns, if 10 gets you in then there's no need to buy 50. If we compare with Meovv, in some fansigns that use the first come first serve system, I noticed that one needs to buy 20 for Meovv (whose core fandom is more typical of kpop groups), but 8 will get you in for ADP. The organizers have all the past sales data before they set those numbers.

Add to that the fact, as you said, that all 5 members are people who looks like they won't starve even if you don't finance them. For some potential buyers this can translate to "why should I make rich people richer?", and for another type of fan (who seek access to idols through financial dependence) you just can't do it to ADP.

Sadly they don't compose a lot in this album, only 1 song is by Tarzzan whereas 5 out of 6 in the first EP has a member in composition.

The choreo may have been finished but they haven't rehearsed enough by the time they shot the MVs. The timeline they work on is really rushed - they filmed Talk on 10 Aug, DILT on 18-19 Aug and Crash on 12-13 Sep.

It's probably YG in general because it reminds me of 2NE1 style (and main composer Kush really has worked with them)

I agree that Annie is more known with the public, but it's not despite being from chaebol family --- it's BECAUSE she's from chaebol family, which is a class of celebrity on their own in Korea. Youngseo herself isn't a high school dropout, she graduated. But Youngseo while popular isn't much different from many other popular female idols. Annie is more unique because not only is she from a chaebol family, she's also a university grad, and even her face isn't the prevalent cute idol type of beauty.

Annie also became relatable to the public because she has shown her personality in bts content and variety shows as grounded and well-spoken, unlike the 'haughty chaebol' image like the Korean Air heiress who lashed out because of nuts in a plane, or even her own family's past story with actress Go Hyunjung.

Annie, or rather Shinsegae, is the most well-known name to the Korean gp, and we can see this from how many Korean articles popup with trivial things she did. "Annie flew economy" "Annie uses b1g1 promo" "the difference between Annie's face when studying and speaking to fans"

The second most recognized is Woochan because of SMTM, and even then a lot of people didn't immediately realize he's the same person -- even in 2026 I still see Youtube comments in Korean saying "what? this is that Jo Woochan? he's really grown!".

Meanwhile Youngseo and Bailey are well known but only to a niche group (idol fans & dance fans). Youngseo seems to have the most loyal idol fans though because the view of her contents are always the highest alongside Annie.

Tarzzan on the other hand is not that well-known before, but his public popularity is growing fast, probably because he's unique among idols and praised for his variety show skills. He's mentioned by a lot of celebrities and keep getting individual offers, including high profile ones like Na PD Netflix show, Gucci Primavera campaign, and composing BigBang's latest single.

Historically, coed groups really don't sell as much as bgs and ggs. ADP is the best selling coed group in kpop history, but that only brings them at best to the level of midtier gg/bg.

Wonyoung is pretty much the top most-wanted individual female idol in Korea right now so I really don't know why you would expect Annie as a rookie to get the same degree of demand, no matter how chaebol-obsessed the Korean public is.

That said, there's an interview (https://system-magazine.com/issues/system-collections-autumn-winter-2026-2027/cynthia-oh-tiffany-godoy) with TBL's visual director Cynthia Oh earlier this year. She talked about many things including how TBL handles brand deals. One example is how Annie actually already got many offers from fashion houses, but they refused because they didn't want to sign anybody in ADP yet in their first album era, and Annie also still wanted the freedom to wear anything she wants. This means that the company takes into consideration what signing to a brand means to the artist, and in the interview Cynthia also talked about how they selected which brands to sign with MEOVV girls.

they did get solo activities, but mostly fashion work. tarzzan & woochan got the most since they each got cast in multi-episode variety shows and featured in taeyang's album, including performing in music shows with him.

Earlier this year Meovv got 3 promoted songs out of 5 and Taeyang got 4 out of 10+, so let's see

Annie speaking here may be awkward, she probably already got financial education from childhood, and already won the lottery at birth 😂

September 26 is part of the magic trick design (see https://www.murphysmagic.com/product.aspx?id=80328), so it may not mean anything. However, by releasing it now TBL must know what impression they are making, so they may be planning something on that date. A teaser is more likely than comeback date, because TBL usually release on Mondays, plus the 26th is Chuseok weekend so most people will have a family gathering, not a good time to release an album.

Well, the age gap isn't as big as 2NE1 (1984 to 1994) or Red Velvet (1991 to 1999).

I feel bad for Annie that she feels scapegoated in this situation, when in fact she flew to Korea twice a month for work and also have returned since May. It's not like she's significantly involved in songwriting, so if TBL had begun production earlier and have her record demos remotely, the finishing process after she returned could be speedier. ADP's gap between comebacks is also not unusual for TBL artists who don't go to school, so I think it really isn't her fault that they missed the momentum.

It's not quite true that they did nothing aside from attending fashion event. They released I Don't Bargain as PUBG collab in March, Woochan & Tarzzan was featured in one of Taeyang's songs and even appeared in music shows with him. Tarzzan became one of the composers of BigBang's BiiiG. Bailey got a special stage in KCON and will appear in SWF Director's War with a solo single. Woochan was in a Buddhism-themed SBS variety show back in May, and Tarzzan's Netflix hiking show last month.

It's Youngseo that still got nothing and that's concerning because she's the one who needs the company the most. The other four have their own unique niche and more well-connected on a personal level, but Youngseo is a typical girl idol, so there's a lot of competition for the kind of opportunities she can get. Even if TBL gets one of those opportunities, she'd be competing internally with other girls in TBL - for example TBL may pitch demos from her, Somi and MEOVV members to be featured as drama OST.

IIRC they said they wanted to call it just Allday, but the name's taken.

Annie only gone for 4 months, not most of the year, and she even flew to Korea twice a month for ad shooting, fansigns and performances. Overall, she was only fully inactive for 1,5 months during exam period. All things considered, I think the effect of Annie (and Woochan) going back to school isn't as significant as TBL's generally slow work pace. In the first half of the year, they've produced for Blackpink, Taeyang, Meovv, izna, IOI and now even BigBang. There's also indication that Meovv was supposed to release earlier but got delayed, as their group name showed up in Mnet app's March comeback poll.

Money is made an excuse a lot of time, but smaller companies than TBL have managed to produce content and time releases to grab opportunities when luck strikes, as shown by MoreVision and Rescene's company. Not uploading any content for 2 months is kinda suicidal in kpop, so they can only rely on the quality of their music and performances when the comeback arrives, but everyone knows that song quality is hit or miss, and ADP isn't a group that can rely on live vocals. They better deliver something the GP likes as much as Famous or they may not survive to 2nd anniversary.

I don't know why the labels launch so many groups... 

What I'm afraid of is the existence of scam agencies that prey on teenagers' dream of being kpop idol, which was inspired by the success of mostly 3rd gen idols. There are plenty of kpop academies offering private audition opportunities. H2H Stella was an academy trainee who got offers from 30 agencies during one such audition.

But what about the ones not chosen by big agencies? Having miniscule chance of debuting would be bad for business, so I worry that some academies and agencies may collude to funnel academy trainees to make them 'debut'. Foreign trainees would be even more vulnerable.

Yes, people should stop using English ability as a drag. It's certainly convenient to have your idol speak a common language with you especially in a fansign/fancall setting, but everyone is free to learn or not learn any language, and it's not the sole measure of intelligence either.

However, when it comes to having lyrics in foreign language, I think it's reasonable to expect singers to be able to pronounce it correctly. Otherwise better stick to lyrics in languages they know.

xdinary heroes is different though, they're a band, and gunil's a highly-skilled drummer, so unlike with idol groups it won't be so easy to restart activities.

i reckon their contract breach penalty wasn't that severe so they dared do that?

Everything he had said about the company and idol life is pretty tame and nothing unexpected by people familiar with kpop, it's just that his delivery is funny and his voice is pleasant to listen to. Looking at his family home in Thailand, it seems like he can afford being a nugu idol in a foreign country, but as an adult it's always good to know you can make your own money.