u/cptchnk

I'm not sure who downvoted me (Reddit is silly sometimes), but yeah, I can see that. The new OLED panel is also the first one available on an Apple laptop that actually has wide Adobe RGB coverage (that matters to some designers and photographers; P3 color space doesn't capture as many of the greens cyans Adobe RGB does). But I guess I just see a lot of people fixate on the touchscreen element of this new panel as if it's the only reason to buy one (it's really is not).

And you can still buy a mini LED MBP for $400 less if the new panel doesn't float your boat. So, at least people have the choice, at least for now.

There are also third-party options for tips that aren't rubber/silicone. A lot of companies make memory foam tips for these. I would see if something like that works for you. I always replace the stock tips with memory foam tips and I find them to be much more comfortable than stock. A lot of these be found on Amazon.

There's other reasons to buy the new model aside from the touchscreen functionality. This is the first tandem OLED panel on an Apple laptop, for example. The touchscreen part I would imagine very few people will actually care about at the end of the day. I've had several PC laptops with touchscreens and often forgot that they were even there (never use them).

But some people really do dig having a touchscreen and use it frequently. It's just a bit of shame that it's only available on the most expensive laptops in the lineup.

Well, it can be argued that a Pro laptop really shouldn't receive RADICAL redesigns because port variety and thermals are still important to actual pro users. I'm just glad that they didn't decide to make this a super thin laptop (that was originally rumored), knowing that the M5 Max chips already run pretty hot, especially in the 14" models.

You did have to suffer through the 15 or so years of Intel MBPs to truly understand what a nightmare a lot of those were with heat, noise, and thermal throttling.

So really, I'd call the weight reduction, while still maintaining a reasonably sized chassis for thermal handling a win.

Sluggish in what ways? What are you editing in and what's your workflow look like?

I've mostly given up on expecting laptops to be truly great editing rigs. I mean, they can be, but you really do get a lot more bang for the buck with a Studio performance-wise and you have access to Ultra chips if your workflow can benefit from additional CPU/GPU cores and encoders/decoders.

It's one of the reasons I haven't really desired to upgrade my M1 Max MBP. It's fine for a mobile machine and I have a Studio sitting on my desk at home for the heavy lifting.

Yes, true story. I'm still making my M1 Max MBP stretch for as long as I possibly can because it's still a great laptop for working on the go. But at home, I'll stick to my Studio with more RAM. :-)

Well, sure. Not debating that.

But both options do exist, so you don't have to buy the OLED version if you don't want to. :)

It could have been worse, too. They could have decided to axe the mini LED models and replace them completely with the new OLED models at the higher price. Also consider that we're talking $400 extra here when a lot of people are already spending $5k+ on new MBPs with Max chips and 64GB of RAM. So, if I were in the market for a new MBP today (which I'm not, honestly), I'd likely pay the extra to get a nicer screen if I was already paying 5 grand for a laptop. But that's just me.

It's all relative, man.

Yeah, it really is a thin, flimsy piece of plastic with magnets in it, but once it's snapped onto the display, you wouldn't really know it.

I initially wanted to go the DIY route (specifically for the bezel and keyboard options), but ultimately, I didn't want to mess with sourcing my own LPCAMM2 memory at the time and I didn't have a spare SSD lying around. And also, the DIY version was a good $250 cheaper (IIRC) with the same specs I would have wanted anyway. So, even swapping the bezel and keyboard later, the prebuilt was the less expensive route for me. But I preordered mine when the prebuilt version was still $2099 (it's $2699 now, I think).

I think a lot of people are getting caught up on the touchscreen and Dynamic Island elements of this display though because they're appealing marketing buzzwords.

I maintain that the TRUE benefits of this new panel are these two things:

1. True blacks and no blooming. The mini LED panel on the standard Pro models still uses a backlight, with local dimming to handle HDR. This introduces anomalies such as "blooming," where if you're looking at a mostly dark scene with high-intensity white (credits at the end of movies are a good example), you'll start to see blooming to a certain degree around those hot spots. OLEDs don't have this problem because each individual pixel emits its own light.
2. Color gamut coverage. The new OLED panel officially supports Adobe RGB (which is wider than P3), which is very good news for designers and photographers that work in that color space.

So ignoring the silly touchscreen gimmick (I agree with that part), this is still a better panel with real benefits for the folks that would appreciate them.

I never suggested that. I'm just saying that the new OLED panel is even better than the mini LED panel from a color gamut perspective. That's all.

Some folks do definitely work in Adobe RGB color space, especially in industries where print proof matching is very critical. I'm not saying this is ALL artists and photographers and I'm not even saying that the older mini LED panel is a bad panel by any stretch. It's still among the best displays you can get on a laptop.

Historically, folks that need a high percentage of Adobe RGB coverage are looking at external monitors that are designed for it. And it isn't always an Apple display.

Well, sure. But my challenge to most folks would be to try to successfully desolder and re-solder a delicate surface-mounted module. It's not as easy as the videos you see on YouTube make it look. The folks that are producing videos like this are board-level repair techs with years of experience.

I mean, you can give that a shot, but I'm not sure if they'd agree to it. A warranty replacement is fundamentally a much different process than selling a computer at retail.

The screen bezels are really the only thing that detracts from the rest of the build, IMHO. I feel that the translucent ones look cheaper than the solid-colored ones, FWIW. I bought a prebuilt X7 358H, so it came with a translucent black one with no option to choose a different color. I'm thinking about buying the solid orange one though, once Framework finally makes the gray/black keyboard available to purchase as a part.

BTW, even the 2.5G Ethernet adapter sticks out a bit versus the other expansion cards, which all sit flush.

Enjoy the new laptop! I've had mine (Batch 9) since last month and it's been great!

I highly doubt that touch operation will actually become a core component of the macOS interface. To me, features like this and Dynamic Island are just selling points slapped on top of the fact that the panel is tandem OLED with even wider color gamut coverage than the mini LED panels in the regular Pro models. The wider color gamut should be the real reason you want this upgraded panel. It would be better for folks that work with graphics and color grade video on the go.

I see this playing out just like how the touchscreens that have been available on PC laptops for quite a while now. It's mostly a gimmick that might have limited practical use with hyper-specific things, like signing a document with your finger or painting in a graphics program, just as two examples.

I've owned several PC laptops with touchscreens (mostly ThinkPads) and I often forget that there's even a touchscreen there. Companies would be shooting themselves in the foot by deviating too far from the traditional keyboard / pointing device arrangement.

And honestly, I only see Apple reserving this feature for top-end models for years to come, just like they do with 120 Hz panels on MacBooks (only on the Pro models).

It's not as simple as greed, actually.

The unified memory on M series chips is soldered to the SoC package. Higher-density memory modules typically cost significantly more than lower-density ones, especially when we're talking about these ultra-fast LPDDR5x modules that AI datacenters have been hogging.

Local LLM is not a poor man's game, sadly.

Sebo models with the ET-1/ET-2 powerheads have a quick-release brush roll for easily cleaning/cutting away the pet hair.

However, if you're all hardwood floors, you don't actually need a powerhead. You just need something with suction-only head and decent power. Sebo K1 or Miele C1 Pure Suction would be good decently priced (but quality) picks.

Yeah, that's why I mentioned that. I wonder what the real world differences will be with the higher compute on a clustered 2x256 setup versus a single 512.

It's $400 over a standard model to essentially get the nicer display. MacBook Pros were already pretty expensive after the price hikes that happened months ago.

Well, the gimmick part really depends. The touchscreen? Definitely a gimmick to me, just based on every laptop I've owned with a touchscreen (several ThinkPads and more recently, a Framework Laptop 13 Pro). I would never actually use it.

But there are other benefits to this new display. For example, the mini LED panel used in the standard Pro doesn't fully cover Adobe RGB, whereas the new OLED panel does. That could matter a lot to photographers and graphic designers working in that color space on the go. Also, no backlight on an OLED, so you'll get those inky blacks without blooming in HDR versus the mini LED panel.

Right, but the OLED model isn't offered with the M6 like the non-OLED model is. Only M5 Pro / M5 Max. So, when doing a comparison that's actually apples to apples, the OLED models cost $400 more (in the US) than the standard models across the board.

What's important to remember is that we're talking about higher density RAM chips, which tend to cost more per gigabyte than the lower density ones. This is actually how RAM has always been, except these days, we're paying a lot MORE for RAM, period.

I suppose buying a 512GB model would make sense from the standpoint of not having to pay a performance penalty for clustering two 256GB machines over Thunderbolt. But we would have to see comparisons between a 512 and a 2x256 cluster to really see where the differences are.

Yet, people keep buying them.

Apple has always marked up RAM quite a bit. This is nothing new. Back in the day when Macs still had user-upgradable RAM, folks had the option to avoid the Apple tax by buying third-party modules. But those days are long gone. :-(

Aside from my wallet crying, I don't really have any regrets with my 1st generation Studio Displays (I own two). They're very nice.

From my POV, "happiness" isn't what I feel with these monitors every time I sit down to use them because these are the exact same panels they used to put inside of the 27" 5K Retina iMacs, only they get a little bit brighter. So for me, it's more like working with something that's already a familiar thing to me. A huge advantage with a 5K display over a 4K one in macOS is the 2560x1400 effective desktop you get with the default 2:1 integer scaling, which gives you quite a bit more room for things than a 4K display will at the same scaling (1920x1080 effective). Also, glossy screens tend to make the blacks pop more than they do on matte screens, so that might be a little bit of what you're noticing.

Now, if I were to buy 5K monitors all over again, I'd probably be looking at options from competitors because for example, you can buy an ASUS ProArt 5K for half the price and get similar performance out of the panel itself. Back when I bought my Studio Displays, the only other 5K option available at the time was the LG UltraFine 5K, but as a refurbished unit. With a Studio Display, you're also paying for that higher-quality build, the nice built-in speakers (they actually do sound pretty good for built-in speakers), and the built-in webcam (the webcam is only okay, but still functional).

No problems to report on my side. I upgraded to the Ultra 4 on launch weekend (purchased at my local Apple Store) and mine came out of the box flawless. 🤷

Cool deal, but I wouldn't necessarily expect Apple to even consider upgrading you to an OLED model. Those are rumored to be offered at like $300-400 higher starting prices versus the standard MBPs and they'll be sold alongside them, not outright replacing them.

If this were me, I would just be happy about the about the fact that I got a brand-new $3,000 machine out of a $500 total investment. Come on, man...