Perez doesn't understand penalty for formation lap error - F1- RaceFans
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[deleted]
f10101 [OP]
A bit more info here about the bizarre double-penalty for Perez and Hartley.
Tagging /u/Fabeling, who I know was interested in this.
KaiBetterThanTyson
Why did Hartley's engineer not inform him over the lap to overtake Perez?. I get Hartley didnt realize but surely the team could have intervened?
E: Just remembered, radio comms are not allowed during the formation lap, thats why the respective teams couldn't do anything about it.
SophisticatedVagrant
That assumes that his engineer would also have noticed and/or realized Checo was supposed to be behind.
Vepanion
That penalty was really way too harsh and completely undeserved.
blowndiffusor
Do we have an onboard of Perez/Hartley from the formation lap?
s1ravarice
Did they line up on the grid in the right position?
f10101 [OP]
Yep. Hartley hadn't yet regained his position at the second safety car line (around the pitlane entrance), though, so it must have looked pretty clumsy when they finally lined up.
s1ravarice
Hmm, does it really affect things as long as they line up on the grid in the right order?
f10101 [OP]
Not really.
I presume they just don't want any messes on the grid. The rule is if you're not in the right slot at the first safety car line, you have to start from the pitlane.
This all has the feel of a rule that was implemented because some driver was an idiot at a GP once, years ago...
oorjit07
gavingav1
Could it be when schumacher overtook hill temporarily on the formation lap of the 1994 british G.P. to intimidate hill, schumacher was black flagged that day .
f10101 [OP]
So much happened that year that I'd forgot the drama behind that... Schumi was really was prone to bizarre bouts of self destructiveness.
DSQ'd from two races, and banned from two others... and yet still won the championship.
How F1 managed to survive after '94, I'll never know...
Fulcoboy
Penalty was way to harsh, should have just received 1 penalty point on their SL as a reminder that such things cannot happen...
LYuen
I found this rule ridiculous when Kvyat received similar penalty when he just got away slowly.
Badoit1778
Its harsh, it doesn't change points and it makes sure others drivers don't do it again.
Just because you are qualifying down the back doesn't mean you can pull weird stuff like this. Imagine if this happened to drivers on the front row.
[deleted]
activator 91 points · Apr 2018 · :ronnie-peterson: Ronnie Peterson
My biggest question is why these harsh penalties even exist for something as harmless as a FORMATION LAP overtake/misunderstanding. A couple of warnings and then some sort of penalty, sure. But 30s right of the bat... What the fuck.
Secone question, if Hartley's engineers didn't realize the mistake, why didnt Perez's guys tell them to tell Hartley.
So easily avoidable but either way, the penalty is beyond ridiculous
KaiBetterThanTyson 38 points · Apr 2018 · :hulk3: I was here for the Hulkenpodium
Agreed, they lined up fine on the grid, so 30s penalty is a bit too severe.
To answer your 2nd question, radio comms are not allowed during the formation lap, thats why the respective teams couldn't do anything about it.
activator 26 points · Apr 2018 · :ronnie-peterson: Ronnie Peterson
Oh now that's just stupid. I mean, if it's something important then they should be allowed to use the radio. This does not affect the race in any way. Damn some of the rules make zero sense
KaiBetterThanTyson 12 points · Apr 2018 · :hulk3: I was here for the Hulkenpodium
The rule was placed to stop the supposed "driver coaching" that the engineers did to get tyres/brakes to optimum temp window and also to help set the clutch bite point in yesteryears. It was to makethe driver and his feel govern the start rather than input from automated systems or engineers.
Also they can break the radio silence rule in-case of emergencies or safety concerns.
Honestly imo, the rule makes sense and has worked well, sometimes stuff like this happens. My main gripe is why penalise the drivers, if they lined up fine on the grid? Perez said overtaking/getting overtaken happens all the time during FL, but drivers regain their appropriate positions (which they have to do before the 2nd safety car line according to the rule.) IMO it should be extended till the grid itself not before the 2nd SC line, If they dont, sure go ahead and reprimand them, but in this case it didnot make much sense to award penalties.
activator 8 points · Apr 2018 · :ronnie-peterson: Ronnie Peterson
Then they need to include these kind of incidences to be allowed to break radio silence, no brainer in my opinion.
Could they have called to Hartley to inform him if they wanted to? Or does Charlie sit on some master switch that turns off radio com?
Because if they can, they should have. They would probably get a small fine or something... Better than 30/10s penalties
dieomesieptoch 10 points · Apr 2018 · :kevin-magnussen: Kevin Magnussen
Preach.
Just because my memory is a bit fuzzy, when was this penalty handed out? Assuming that was during the race but especially reading how the guys talked to Charlie about it and explained what happened, I'm wondering if the stewards can ever revoke a given penalty?
CUwallaby 1 points · Apr 2018 · :26Piastri: Oscar Piastri
It was announced at some point during the race but I believe it was applied after the race was concluded. I don't believe he served it in the pits.
f10101 [OP] 2 points · Apr 2018 · :kamui-kobayashi: Kamui Kobayashi
Yep. Both 30 second penalties after the race, plus two points for Hartley. They were applied after speaking with the drivers.
[deleted] 4 points · Apr 2018
Its a black and white rule. So id say Perez messed up by zooming off the start line without respect to the guy in front of him on the left. And Hartley messed up by not retaking the position when Perez slowed damn near to a stop at the first corner.
Blame the drivers for fucking up the procedure. Not the rule makers for applying the rules. If everyone did it it would be chaos. So you have to punish procedural rules violations, even though it seems over the top.
CUwallaby 5 points · Apr 2018 · :26Piastri: Oscar Piastri
I mean, I can believe this statement from Checo. If they're nearly side by side it's not that big of a deal, especially when it's almost always resolved before they file into a single line.
[deleted] 2 points · Apr 2018
Of course it isnt a big deal, its procedural. And it was pretty harsh on perez, I wouldnt have given him one but its easy to see why he got one. Cant be lax on procedure.
[deleted] 1 points · Apr 2018
I'm baffled by both but even more so for Hartley because he didn't take the position back. Silly.