u/IHaveAScythe

If i was say, a salamanders player and I wanted the multi meltas and wasn’t interested in the grav guns, it now costs me MORE to get full squads of multi meltas.

That's only if you also don't care about the lascannons, or the missile launchers, or the plasma cannons, or the heavy bolters. It's only a worse deal for you if you're trying to get that one specific squad with that one specific loadout and have no interest in expanding your army and collection beyond that. Even if you only care about two heavy weapon types and throw the other four in the trash, devastators at that point are "only" as cost efficient as their primaris equivalents.

This also ignores that GW could have easily just... put more guns in the box instead of refreshing the kit by replacing it with half a dozen new ones that still manage to leave roles and weapon types unfulfilled while also giving you less stuff in each box overall (with the only exception being hellblasters, since at least they come in boxes of 10).

If you wanted to de-aspect warrior space marines (or the game as a whole), you’d either need to force specific weapon loadouts across entire squads, or rework the entire game so that people aren’t incentivized to equip their squads that way.

I disagree with this. Wargear costs could help incentivize mixing weapon types to save points for other parts of the list, and even just going back to a single unit with lots of wargear choices and a generalist ability that isn't specialized for a specific weapon and role would help make marines feel less like aspect warriors and more like marines. And from a modeling perspective, it's worth noting that other armies haven't undergone this same aspect warrior-ification. CSM, as the most direct comparison, still have legionaires and havocs that operate like tacticals and devastators did.

A tactical squad cost the same as a box of devastators but came with twice as many marines (10 vs 5) and the devastator squad came with 8 extra heavy weapons left over after you built the squad, enough to turn a tactical box into two squads. So two devastators + 2 tacticals got you 6 squads for the price of 4 boxes instead of having to buy 6 devastator boxes.that was a savings of like $120 USD.

I could see control being "the war hasn't gone hot, so the Reapers are staying out of it," so they can explicitly reference the ending you chose but not make things too different from destroy so it's still feasible in one game. But idk how you'd explain synthesis.

I mean, when his dad grabbed him and took him along they did go around holding entire villages hostage and torching their homes, and Spider was powerless to stop it...

The fact that everything around them wants them dead is also self-inflicted though. When you go around the galaxy genociding every alien you can, the ones left aren't gonna like you, especially when you're still spouting "death to the xenos" constantly. Like, there were alien races willing to be friends with humanity, and the Imperium pretty much killed all of them off, except for the Tau.

Also the hyper religiousness isn't a shield against Chaos - the holy book was literally written by Lorgar. I'm pretty sure the Armageddon crusade book also mentions Helbrecht's purging of heretics in one of the hives being a spectacular amount of bloodshed that helped Khorne too. The authoritarianism is also absolutely not needed for humanity to defend itself, that's just the system they set up.

Paul is explicitly not part of the Fremen, the Arab-inspired culture.

Also, like, idk if being genocidal imperial religious zealots is really that much of an upgrade over being a terrorist, if you're trying to act like this is somehow robbing Arabs of positive rep. Paul even straight up says he's worse than Hitler in the book.

That you're probably not a person I ever want to play against. Good opponents don't want an unfair, one sided stomp, because if you're actually approaching 40k as a social activity where you want everyone involved to enjoy themselves, you don't enjoy winning that kind of game. But when someone says "unfair one sided stomps in general are bad" and your response is to tell them that they're the problem and they need to learn to have fun getting their teeth kicked in (funny how the thought that they're winning that kind of game never occurs to you), it's pretty clear you don't want a level playing field because you don't want an opponent, you want a punching bag to roll dice at.

A level playing field means they lose as often as they win. I honestly find it very telling that you literally read "I want me and my opponent to have a fair match" and your takeaway was somehow that they only enjoy winning.

I don't play AdMech, but it really is dumb that Cawl has done more for a completely different range than he has for his own.

Also just in general I feel like there's plenty of potential for Admech's internal conflict between the more radical factions and the die-hard dogmatics to show in their models more if GW was just willing to do it.

No it's not?

It's more like "you can't even acknowledge that Trump Tower exists or you're supporting Trump. This is your weekly reminder that talking about Trump Tower means you're supporting bombing Iran. Stop talking about Trump Tower!"

ETA: like seriously, pointing out the absurdity of "I'm going to keep talking about HP to remind people to shut up about HP because just talking about it is bad" is absolutely not the same as "you dislike society but live in one," come on.

Which I honestly find deeply ironic, because probably like 95% of the time I'm thinking about Harry Potter it's against my will and it's caused by a post about how bad it is to give JKR and HP any attention.

Idk, I feel like this comment basically boils down to "a new/casual player with an unopotimized list will get clobbered by someone with a decent list, and the only solution is for them to buy new units for a better list, and also an edition fhange affects what's good" which has always been the case. Nothing about that's really unique to 11th.

What they really should have done is made this an index edition and updated everything for everyone, especially given that other stuff like the psychic overhaul is also in this weird zone of being updated for each army on a codex basis. But I guess they didn't want the flack from invalidating all the codexes two editions in a row.

Maybe, but I doubt it. It was months before the SW stuff culled in 10th actually got added to Legends, and GW didn't even bother updating the datasheets to be in line with the movement increase the codex units got.

Looking at my Space Wolves, all the legends units are still just copy pasted from the 10th index. I wouldn't get my hopes up for GW doing anything to actually update tacticals or any other legends units to the new marine statline.

Regardless of what anyone even thinks of the quality of the run, I really want to know the exact quote OOP is talking about in the tags, because I have a very hard time believing that what I've read of that run was written by someone trying to prove a Wonder Woman story doesn't have to be about women.

Also replying to stay updated on this.

Also, as someone's who's read part of Tom King's Wonder Woman run, and isn't a particularly big fan of it, this doesn't really make any sense to me? If he really said he's trying to prove that WW stories don't need to be about women, or that they shouldn't be feminist, then I really have to question what the fuck he was trying to do?

Like, his run is absolutely about women. The Sovereign is explicitly sexist and repeatedly makes disparaging comments about WW being an uppity woman. There's a whole part of the story where he uses the Lasso of Lies to try and brainwash her into being obedient and submissive and places her in a fake reality where she's an obedient 50s housewife to a stereotypically misogynist fake Steve Trevor.

It's feeling like GW wanted this to be a reset edition but was too scared to actually do that 2 editions in a row. Not even just because of the stat changes - the updates to psykers also really feel like that should have just happened gamewide.

So you agree that the problem with primaris wasn't that they were taller, it was everything else about how they were done.

I mean, it's also the fact that now marines have almost all hover vehicles like they're Eldar, the lore is that this is all mass-adopted brand-new tech like the Tau despite being a faction that's supposedly incredibly backwards and technologically regressive, and the fact that many kits and datasheets have removed options to instead give us ridiculous amounts of bloat in the range (like seriously, look at how many kits and datasheets primaris need to try to match most of the options Devastators alone had), not to mention the kits being blander (seriously - every Firstborn kit I've bought has at least had a mk6 helmet in addition to the typical mk7, but with primaris "the kit has helmets from older marks of armor" was literally the selling point for the marine half of the edition launch box).

It's almost bafflingly disingenuous to say that the problem was just that primaris are taller. Did you miss all the upscaled Firstborn releases in HH that people are fine with? Or even how well-received the terminator refresh last edition was?

Didn't intercessors lose the special rule for extra shots though? So even a 100% damage increase with the 2 damage profile is just putting them at their current damage output.

Warcom has been making mistakes on stuff like this for years (for another recent example: leaving the boxnought off the list of Firstborn going to Legends), so I think it's far more likely that they just had a miscommunication and missed that WS would be getting their detachment too.

Yeah I was pretty happy with how my Space Wolves' army roster was when I started in 8th. We had access to enough regular datasheets (some with at least a few tweaks to match fluff and alter how they played) to feel like a complete army without just being "vanilla marines, but then also a bunch of extra stuff." You didn't have the headache of us getting all of vanilla marines' toys, but we weren't like EC where we were missing basic stuff that should absolutely be in the army.

That'd be the ideal, but who knows what GW will actually end up doing.

Because maybe you don't want any of the mythics you could use the voucher on?

50 prisms to spend on something you want and will actually use is better than 80 prisms worth of stuff you'll never touch

And the issue there was that Steve and Natasha were literally trying to stop the government, which had been taken over by Nazis. The Accords actively would have made things worse there because Steve would have basically had to go ask for permission to go to war against the US. Not to mention that's one example where it wasn't even just superheroes, regular not-Nazi shield agents were also trying to bring down the helicarriers. Because, again, the alternative there was letting Nazis take over the world. They aren't the ones who need to face repercussions for that.