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Sword Art Online: Alicization - Episode 11 Discussion (Anime Only)

69 points · submitted Dec 2018 by u/ZeHaffen · Official Discussion

Episode 11: Central Cathedral

セントラル・カセドラル

THIS IS AN ANIME-ONLY THREAD. LIGHT NOVEL READERS SHOULD DISCUSS HERE.

All spoilers regarding events not yet shown in the anime MUST be tagged. There is a zero-tolerance policy for any and all untagged light novel spoilers posted here - violators will be banned for 7 days and repeat offenses will be banned for longer, depending on spoiler severity.

Knowledge of the main series anime up to and including Ordinal Scale is assumed in this thread. Spoilers for SAO, SAO II, and Ordinal Scale can be untagged.

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Please note that no English dub has been announced at this time. For countries other than the US, check your local distributor!

Show Information

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Official Website (Japan)

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Previous Discussions

Episode 10 - Taboo Index

Episode 9 - Nobleman's Responsibilities

Episode 8 - Swordsman's Pride

Episode 7 - Swordcraft Academy

Episode 6 - Project Alicization

Episode 5 - Ocean Turtle

Episode 4 - Departure

Episode 3 - The End Mountains

Episode 2 - The Demon Tree

Episode 1 - Underworld

Sword Art Online: Alicization - Episode 11 Discussion (Anime Only)

160 comments · 95% upvoted · other discussions

comments

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[deleted] 86 points · Dec 2018

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jtipt 66 points · Dec 2018

The walking stance of that 2nd guy seemed like the laughing coffin guy from the OP

amisamiamiam 4 points · Dec 2018 · Dual Blades

They look to me like the two dudes who Eugeo and Kirito just chopped up. I bet they are logging in.

banana12999ee 2 points · Dec 2018

Yooo what the fuck I didn’t think of this at all but I got a feeling your right, guess we’ll see

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Jahgreen 18 points · Dec 2018

Probably LC, the lab owner setup Kirito to get stabbed by the LC. This way Kirito had no choice but to stay throughout the experiment. That is my theory.

Ryuuji_Gremory 17 points · Dec 2018 · Asuna

But Kirito was already onboard with staying throughout the experiment out of his own free will, risking him getting actually killed, arriving brain dead in the hospital, would be kind of far too big a risk for basically no gain.

Nosiege 6 points · Dec 2018

Perhaps their plan was to see if the Medicuboid thing could fix neurological damage.

They've shown to have multiple plans running concurrently, and advancing their med tech with the best possible candidate could be seen as a safe test.

Ryuuji_Gremory 12 points · Dec 2018 · Asuna

That doesn't make much sense though, they could easily just find someone that already has neurological damage, maybe even someone from the army, you know a vet that was wounded, and try to heal him instead of deliberately causing neurological damage on Kirito and risking to kill him when he is a valuable asset.

The whole "we need someone that is accustomed to the virtual world" would be irrelevant to the healing process, it was only necessary to be able to live a natural second live in underworld which is clearly not what is happening to Kirito right now.

Also if they would go over corpses that easily for that little gain, without hesitation it doesn't make sense that Asuna is alive and well and treated as a guest, getting an explanation of the project instead of being locked away or even getting shot on sight for trespassing into a top secret military facility. It would be completely inconsistent.

Nosiege 3 points · Dec 2018

The whole "we need someone that is accustomed to the virtual world" would be irrelevant to the healing process,

No it's not; it's clear they use the virtual world to stimulate the brain. Especially in a dangerous once they've created for the purpose of war robots.

Ryuuji_Gremory 6 points · Dec 2018 · Asuna

Yes it is irrelevant to the healing, you can be in the virtual world, the same way Kirito is right now, even if you aren't accustomed to it, it wouldn't make a difference.

They wanted Kirito specifically for the purpose of having him live a second childhood there as an inhabitant of Underworld, in that case the sense of discomfort that you might feel if you aren't accustomed might interfere with the experiment.

That experiment and the dive right now are completely different things, in the current dive it wouldn't matter if he wasn't accustomed, just like it didn't matter for the original 4 that spend over 18 years in Underworld raising the first inhabitants.

[deleted] 2 points · Dec 2018

maybe they wanted kirito because of what happened with Alice breaking the taboo index?

Ryuuji_Gremory 3 points · Dec 2018 · Asuna

But why would they risk killing him then ? he was already contracted to test dive for them and he would have had no qualms with doing it again, while he doesn't want to make the STL his future he wants to see what it is about.

Also to consider the whole project is based on the train of though that the lives of every single Japanese citizen, well he specifically said JSDF soldier but assuming that extends to the innocent people the JSDF is supposed to be protecting isn't a stretch, are of outmost importance to him and that they are worth thousands upon thousands of artificial Fluctlights, in other words actual human beings that just don't have a body of flesh and blood.

[deleted] 2 points · Dec 2018

But why would they risk killing him then ?

because he could live in the underworld for more then 11 years at a time.

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Jahgreen 2 points · Dec 2018

Except there were parts Kirito had issues with. It alludes to it in the beginning when they were having the hush hush talks between himself and Asuna. Also Kirito might have mentioned the fact he was thinking of moving to America and they didn't want to lose him.

Ryuuji_Gremory 2 points · Dec 2018 · Asuna

Kirito is planning on going to America to study, he has no intention of just suddenly vanishing from japan.

He doesn't want to make the SLT his future, because he can feel Kayaba's influence in it, but he clearly states he does want to see what the whole thing is about, he wouldn't just leave halfway through his job that he already agreed to do.

Jahgreen 2 points · Dec 2018

Not the way I took that scene. I took the scene as he knows what SLT can do and wants to see if America has a viable alternative. I think Kirito senses greater risks when messing with the soul.

Ryuuji_Gremory 2 points · Dec 2018 · Asuna

No he straight up says he wants to see what's the STL is about but he doesn't want to make it his future because he think it's an extension of Kayaba's ambition and making that his life would feel like he was still dancing in his palm. Furthermore he thinks that there is more to the STL then just being a Full Dive interface and that it's years from being anywhere near viable for the average consumer. He also thinks the brain implant chip, that is being developed in America, will be the next gen Full Dive machine and therefore he wants to go and study there.

[deleted] 3 points · Dec 2018

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BleedingUranium 8 points · Dec 2018 · Argo's Guide

Alice didn't break any taboos intentionally (she never got a seal warning or blew her eye out), therefore she's actually not what Rath is after. The only relevant person we know of is actually Eugeo.

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Crimsonavenger2000 2 points · Dec 2018

That actually is pretty well thought lol

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[deleted] 4 points · Dec 2018

Yes

Link2Sora 3 points · Dec 2018 · Lisbeth

I think it's possible but not likely that one of them is Anime (Ordinal Scale) Spoiler

i_demand_cats 3 points · Dec 2018

my first thought is that they are the 2 researchers who were in those slime monster bodies while asuna was attempting to escape from her yggdrasil prison in ALO

J-Carbonaro 3 points · Dec 2018

that would suck. I don't want to watch another flubby pink blob play with Asuna

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ThulianSlate 2 points · Dec 2018

I’m curious as to how you came to this conclusion

i_demand_cats 3 points · Dec 2018

just a feeling really, the cinematography of the situation made me feel like those two had a specific relationship with asuna in particular, that said they could just be two new characters that will be explained later but somehow i doubt they dont at least have some familiar background

behnow5 2 points · Dec 2018

Didn't one or both of them go down with sugou though?

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[deleted] 48 points · Dec 2018

I'm writing this as the episode goes on so I'll probably make a bunch of speculation mistakes which get proved wrong immediately!

Jesus Christ, Alice was savage as fuck, 30 seconds into the episode and I'm already feeling heartbroken for Eugeo, man has been through enough, no need to bitch slap him with your golden sword!

Also Tiesse and Ronie struggling with those swords and Alice just easily picking them up really shows the strength difference between the characters at the moment.

Ronie really knows what Kirito cares about too! "Here's your lunch", that's one way to get him to take whatever is in that bag (which I assume isn't lunch)

The robot is creepy, I'm not sure if I like the robot, the name sounds like a Pokémon though, so I kind of like the robot.

I wonder if the second robot is the representation of Kayaba that Rinko saw before, that would be pretty interesting, I mean Kayaba's brain is somewhere in digital space, so it would make sense if they put it into a robot for now

Those guys that walked past Asuna for sure looked like laughing coffin guys. Just saying.

I like the scenes when it's just Eugeo and Kirito talking too, and it's nice to see how Kirito and Eugeo can have a similar conversation to Kirito and Sinon about how it feels to have just killed someone, about how it doesn't matter now, you've got to finish what you've started, you can reconcile it later.

I also like Kirito theorising on things, it makes me feel like he knows as little as me about the world he's in.

Also I definitely want Kirito to be with me if I'm ever locked in one of those escape room things, yet again showing that he's a brain and a half when it comes to manipulating the rules of any virtual world he's in.

I love that we're seeing Eugeo's character more clearly now, and it's obvious that he's not just another AI, it was frustrating at first, honestly, to watch him be such a stickler for rules even if it made sense for what he was, but now his motives and reasoning are much more human, just wanting to go back to his village with Alice, that's a motive that we can all understand, not just doing things because that's what the rules say.

Blushing Eugeo is so cute, this bromance is great, we'd better not tell Klein, he might get jealous

And yet again such a great close to the episode, I can't wait until next week to find out what happens! Kirito's wit is sharp as ever, and the integrity knight seems like he's got some jokes in him too. He does seem powerful though, and Eugeo and Kirito only have their chains to fight with. But I think from now on this is serious for Kirito, before he could coast on his muscle memory of fighting and didn't really push himself other than the fight with Raios, but now I think we'll see Kirito stretching his legs a bit more in every fight

Also it seems like I was wrong about the Alice taking them being a copy, since she is synthesis 30 and the knight at the end of the episode is synthesis 31, so other people were right when they said that it was just a numbering system. Also important to learn that Integrity knights have a region assigned to them, I assume Alice is assigned to the capital region since she picked up Kirito and Eugeo, so I guess that whoever is in charge of the integrity knights will always assign them to a region that they haven't lived in before to make sure that their brainwashing isn't undone, this also gives a clear goal for what Kirito and Eugeo have to do: Get Alice back to the village

Nosiege 7 points · Dec 2018

I love that we're seeing Eugeo's character more clearly now, and it's obvious that he's not just another AI, it was frustrating at first,

That's because Kiritos influence has the power to make the fluctlights think independently, since he's the only truly organic fluctlight.

[deleted] 7 points · Dec 2018

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Nosiege 2 points · Dec 2018

The inherent problem of growing up in a VR world is that it stunts the fluctlights growth capacity, which is evidenced by the strict adherence to the Taboo Index, and the fatal program crashes experienced when disobeying it (EG: untie your arms to tie mine to stop the bleeding)

Since we are dealing with something "organic", some Alice-type AIs appear that are able to break the Taboo Index without shutting down, likely through "crimes" of pure chance and accident, AKA, Alice herself, or by bending the wording to suit a desire. Kirito has been defined of making the AI change in that manner. Eugeo's growth is 100% purely due to Kirito's influence, and not because of Eugeo himself.

JackFlynt 2 points · Dec 2018 · Sinon

Wasn't the Taboo Index a construct of the system itself though? It's not a fact of the simulation, it was created by the fluctlights as they formed a civilisation and enforced... somehow. Probably through some form of cargo cult admin command "Sacred Art". The real people noticed it one day, but they didn't put it there. Regardless, being bound to it isn't a failure of VR people, it's a limitation of VR people who were created in that particular simulation.

I also think the VR fluctlights aren't any more vulnerable to collapse than a real world human would be, their triggers are just more easily accessible because the Index dictates them very clearly for all to read

Remember the earlier episode when they started up a simulation of one of the real world people there, and it broke down in moments because it couldn't comprehend that it wasn't a real person in the sense that it considered a person to be? Raios was different, he got caught in a loop rather than against a wall, but they both crashed because they couldn't comprehend and process the input they were given, and while one was a VR baby the other was functionally a real person.

Actual people with fleshy bits are more resilient because they can still experience the world and there is no Taboo Index to trap them in, but I would suspect that if you could present them with a similarly inescapable, incomprehensible stimulus, they would die quite spectacularly.

Or maybe I should stop writing long theory comments at 1am

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seitaer13 3 points · Dec 2018 · Strongest Player of 2020

All the fluctlights are capable of thinking independently.

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Lazearound10am 27 points · Dec 2018

A little detail regarding the rose garden the anime omitted:

- Flowers in Underworld are a great source of magical power, they are capable to store a lot of 'Terraria blessing', and very easy to draw energy from.

- Roses are the highest class of flower, their energy level overshadows any other type of flower. But they are very rare, almost never grow in the wild and still really hard to tend to in human's hand

​

BleedingUranium 13 points · Dec 2018 · Argo's Guide

What a fantastic episode! It's really nice to see Asuna more relaxed and back to her usual self; getting flustered at accidentally using Higa's mannerisms was an especially great moment. More Kirito speeches and Eugeo resolve is always great, as well as classic Kirito ingenuity. Eldrie's intro music was really awesome too, that fight is gonna be fun!

[deleted] 7 points · Dec 2018

She wasn't at all relaxed in the LN. Her heart was aflame and all she could say internally was "Kirito-kun". She was really heartbroken and was missing Kirito a lot.

BleedingUranium 9 points · Dec 2018 · Argo's Guide

That's really not what I mean, I mean that she's not just fuming and angry like last time we saw her; she's had more time to process things, and is perfectly content to hang around with Higa and just have a casual conversation about stuff.

homie_down 2 points · Dec 2018 · Alice

Yeah it's nice to see her cooled off, although tbf she definitely had her fair share of reasons to be fuming and angry, considering everything that happened to Kirito lol

[deleted] 26 points · Dec 2018

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Nosiege 15 points · Dec 2018

Another tower in SAO feels correct. I love Alicization.

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lukemcadams 23 points · Dec 2018

I'm assuming kirito will have to tell eugeo the truth about everything eventually, but knowing eugeo it will probably make him stronger in a way

OneMillionRoses 45 points · Dec 2018 · Asuna

In Kirito's defense telling your best friend his entire world is just the Matrix created by some jerks who love to play God and he doesn't even have an organic body because his soul is in a light cube is not an easy thing to do.

[deleted] 12 points · Dec 2018

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AwkwrdPrtMskrt 21 points · Dec 2018

  1. I predict people will make GIFs of Alice scabbarding Eugeo.

  2. Asuna getting scared by Ichiemon (heheh). Who is that mysterious guy though?

  3. Ladies and gentlemen, introducing Tsundere Eugeo!

[deleted] 3 points · Dec 2018

I predict people will make GIFs of Alice scabbarding Eugeo.

Berserk 2K16 clang intensifies

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Stonemario0 7 points · Dec 2018 · Kirito

Now I would say I had mixed feelings with this season a couple of weeks ago,but that has changed.I'm enjoying myself consistently now.I also can't wait to see how Kirito and Eugeo will fight in the next episode.Could go on but I'll leave that to people who can speak fluently through text,as I'm not too good at it myself.

CrimsonKingXIII 7 points · Dec 2018 · Chrome Disaster

That guard sure is a sound sleeper, also that place must not get a lot of prisoners because no one else seemed to be there other than Kirito and Eugeo. I liked seeing the robot and how they were talking about putting a fluctlight into one of them, that whole concept of putting a human mind into a machine intrigues me and is something I honestly wouldn't mind seeing in my lifetime. Now to wait for next week to see how Eugeo and Kirito fare in their battle with this Integrity Knight.

Nerzana 10 points · Dec 2018

I'd imagine there aren't many others who break the taboo index and get thrown in that jail.

ChKliffnme 6 points · Dec 2018

Isn't it confirmed that the Artificial Fluctlights can't break the taboo index? Therefore no one can except for Kirito and those influenced by him

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BippityBorp 14 points · Dec 2018

k Tiese is best girl and anyone who says otherwise can fight me

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also Ronie/Ronye being adorable as hell was great\

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oh god that knight doesn't know what he's doing, Jesus-kun has a chain around his wrist

[deleted] 10 points · Dec 2018

[deleted]

BleedingUranium 13 points · Dec 2018 · Argo's Guide

This seems like a safe assumption, especially given he also said he was only "summoned" a month ago.

dark77638 5 points · Dec 2018

He is Alice’s trainee, he said it himself

miriichuu18 4 points · Dec 2018

Hmmm... it’s like Alice is Eldrie’s mentor. Alice became Integrity Knight first then Eldrie next. Whatever she learned, she passed on to him. Something like that.

AsunasPersonalAsst 3 points · Dec 2018 · Mini Sandwich-kun

What did the anime do to Ronye's lunch bag?????

Mynthence 2 points · Dec 2018

The paper bag was on Kirito's bed in their prison cell. I was surprised they let him bring it in. Since they didn't take it when they left the cell, I'm assuming they left the bag behind. Knowing Kirito, he probably ate whatever was inside by the time they show the two inside their cell.

Ryuuji_Gremory 2 points · Dec 2018 · Asuna

It was actually food for both of them, and they were in their cells already for 1 1/2 days, so yes they probably ate it.

Envein 3 points · Dec 2018 · Alice

It's all about that bromance baby (｡•̀ᴗ-)✧

VegitoSSB 4 points · Dec 2018

So does Kirito still know that he isnt in the real world? What was the whole regaining his old memories back about? Was he just yanking on Eugeo's chain (ha!)?

Meij99 15 points · Dec 2018

In an earlier episode Kirito told Eugeo that he "forgot" his memories as a means to blend in with the world

IanEuler 2 points · Dec 2018

Well, he did forget some memories right? He doesn’t remember anything about what happened in the first episode as children with Eugeo, Alice, and himself. He remembers what happened in the real world, but did lose some memories in the virtual one.

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seitaer13 11 points · Dec 2018 · Strongest Player of 2020

The residents of the Underworld believe Kirito is a "lost child of vector" I.E someone who has their memories stolen.

Kirito has all of his memories and knows he's inside the STL.

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HexoFlux 4 points · Dec 2018

Why did Asuna look like she is embarrassed after asking Higa about the second unit's name? I don't get it.

Ryuuji_Gremory 25 points · Dec 2018 · Asuna

She was about to slip into Higa's speech pattern (the sub has it as a 'kay at the end of each sentence) but noticed it and corrected herself.

HexoFlux 3 points · Dec 2018

Ah that makes sense. Thanks!

Crimsonavenger2000 4 points · Dec 2018

Don't really like how Kirito broke that jail like it was nothing (OP?), but the rest of the ep was pretty gud

dtape467 27 points · Dec 2018

the bars have a lower level than the chain

Crimsonavenger2000 2 points · Dec 2018

Ah that makes sense

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[deleted] 3 points · Dec 2018

The chains that bounded them were level 38 whereas the bars were of much lower level so he could bust it open with a higher level item.

monkeybrain3 2 points · Dec 2018

I watch these on Sundays so I'm late, but why doesn't Kirito use more "magic?" He got told in the flower episode that he just needs to think and imagine it happening for "magic," to happen so how come he isn't using more magic?

Also I actually like the detail when Kirito says some remark to a "higher," up person and they get irritated. No one is use to people bending their "spot in life." Wouldn't that have worked on the last episode with the two nobels though? They get their power from being superior to commoners so wouldn't Kirito saying something of how sad it is that he couldn't beat a commoner completely destroy his ego and thus his power?

xRoastedRice 2 points · Dec 2018

I don't like how they put kirito in a tough spot to make him look good at the end (fight against those nobles). That shit does not satisfy me i wan kirito to rip them apart instantly to show his badassness 👌👌👌

monkeybrain3 2 points · Dec 2018

I agree, I'm waiting for the moment he can use all his old move sets again and just obliterate people who in the VR have spent their whole lives trying to perfect. I was really expecting him to destroy that 1st seat guy to be honest but it kinda went nowhere.

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zxHellboyxz 3 points · Dec 2018

How are they going to fight without a weapon

[deleted] 24 points · Dec 2018

Kirito's Senpai in the academy (can't remember her name right now) fought using a whip at times, he must have picked up a few tricks that he can use with his chain

McStoickson 15 points · Dec 2018

Sortiliena Serlut is her name.

[deleted] 5 points · Dec 2018

yup, that's the one, I'm bad with names

McStoickson 4 points · Dec 2018

No worries, I had to google it as well.

Ryuuji_Gremory 9 points · Dec 2018 · Asuna

Well Kirito's mentor, Liena-senpai, used a whip in her fighting style (you can see it when they spar), so while far far outclassed in terms of weapons it's not like they are really completely unarmed and at least one of them should know at least somewhat how to use the weapon they have the chains

Vindicare605 7 points · Dec 2018 · Klein

If the chains are strong enough to break down prison doors with a single swing, they should make for at least a mediocre weapon.

It also is two on one.

Vindicare605 5 points · Dec 2018 · Klein

Can't help but feel disappointed with this one, very little happened and very little was set up in this episode.

Oh well, the wait begins anew for another week.

Stonemario0 6 points · Dec 2018 · Kirito

Now that you mentioned it,it did seem like nothing much happened.But compared to other episodes so far I enjoyed it more then some of the others.Maybe I'm just in a better mood today or something.

Vindicare605 4 points · Dec 2018 · Klein

In some of the previous slow UW episodes they spent a lot of time doing exposition and world building so I was ok with it.

seitaer13 14 points · Dec 2018 · Strongest Player of 2020

It's not really supposed to be. Much of it was the interlude with Asuna, and then set up to move the characters around, fallout from the previous episode, foreshadowing etc.

Just because an episode of something isn't full of action doesn't mean nothing happens.

BleedingUranium 10 points · Dec 2018 · Argo's Guide

SAO is really meant to be viewed as a very long movie, rather than being truly episodic. Having a calmer episode after last week, as well as transitioning into the events of the next 13 episodes is exactly what this part of the story needed to be.

There was a lot of fantastic stuff in this episode anyway, I loved it.

seitaer13 9 points · Dec 2018 · Strongest Player of 2020

People are just so used to manga adaptations, where manga generally ends on some sort of cliffhanger each week, while a novel does not. So SAO doesn't always have a ton of stuff going on every episode.

StarForceStelar 12 points · Dec 2018

Exactly ppl just want action even if it makes the plot nonexistent but then bitch that there is no plot

Crimsonavenger2000 10 points · Dec 2018

Yeah, same thing for that episode where Asuna went to the lab for the first time. Not a lot happened, but it was a fantastic epsiode

StarForceStelar 7 points · Dec 2018

If they didnt put best girl ppl were gonna bitch saying "I can't believe they are cutting her out"

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Sendmepupperpics 2 points · Dec 2018

My thoughts exactly. Reading the comments on this sub I would've thought I watched a different episode entirely. Absolutely nothing happened.

Eugeo got slapped because Alice doesn't remember him, and they escaped the worst built prison in history with no effort. The Asuna interludes were entirely pointless.

zxHellboyxz 2 points · Dec 2018

they escaped the worst built prison in history with no effort.

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doubt any ordinary civilian has a level 38 object authority to even be able to break the chains then escape

Sendmepupperpics 2 points · Dec 2018

Yes... because ordinary civilians, who up until this point literally couldn't break the taboo index, are the ones the prison was built for.

In their world, anyone capable of being put in prison in the first place is a big deal. Yet they put both of them in the same cell and had a single useless guard. If they even bothered to have a second guard, they could take shifts and have one be awake at all times.

Yes the Integrity Knight appears at the end, but if Kirito and Eugeo decided they just wanted to leave they just... could have. It just so happens they wanted to traverse the tower and en route they were caught, but the Knight basically lucked out.

zxHellboyxz 2 points · Dec 2018

Depends on who breaks it I guess. I'm curious to have a look to see of anyone els has broken it and sent to prison besides a kid

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WinlanU21 2 points · Dec 2018

Only 11 episodes and we’re already at the cathedral. Is there that much content in Alicization?

dark77638 7 points · Dec 2018

Yes, Alicization is much more than the cathedral

overtt 4 points · Dec 2018

Yes. And they even skipped one of my favorite parts ( Zakkaria) but Alicization arc is HUGE compared to previous arcs

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