Sword Art Online: Alicization - War of Underworld - Episode 11 (Anime Only)

Episode 11: Heartless Choice

非情の選択

THIS IS AN ANIME-ONLY THREAD. [LIGHT NOVEL READERS SHOULD DISCUSS HERE]().

All spoilers regarding events not yet shown in the anime MUST be tagged. There is a zero-tolerance policy for any and all untagged light novel spoilers posted here - violators will be banned for 7 days and repeat offenses will be banned for longer, depending on spoiler severity.

Knowledge of the main series anime up to and including Ordinal Scale is assumed in this thread. Spoilers for SAO, SAO II, Ordinal Scale, and Alicization Part 1 can be untagged.


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The English dub airs every Saturday night on Toonami at 12:30am EST! It is currently behind the Japanese release by 17 episodes. For countries other than the US, check your local distributor!

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Official Website (Japan)

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Previous Discussions

War of Underworld

Episode 10 - Stacia, the Goddess of Creation

Episode 9 - Sword and Fist

Episode 8 - Blood and Life

Episode 7 - Brand of a Failure

Episode 6 - Battle of the Knights

Episode 5 - Night Before Battle

Episode 4 - Dark Territory

Episode 3 - Final Load Test

Episode 2 - Raids

Episode 1 - In the Northern Lands

Alicization

Episode 24.5 - Reflection

Episode 24 - My Hero

Episode 23 - Administrator

Episode 22 - Titan of the Sword

Episode 21 - The 32nd Knight

Episode 20 - Synthesis

Episode 19 - Seal of the Right Eye

Episode 18.5 - Recollection

Episode 18 - The Legendary Hero

Episode 17 - Truce

Episode 16 - The Osmanthus Knight

Episode 15 - The Relentless Knight

Episode 14 - The Crimson Knight

Episode 13 - Ruler and Mediator

Episode 12 – The Sage of the Library

Episode 11 – Central Cathedral

Episode 10 – Taboo Index

Episode 9 – Nobleman's Responsibilities

Episode 8 – Swordsman's Pride

Episode 7 – Swordcraft Academy

Episode 6 – Project Alicization

Episode 5 – Ocean Turtle

Episode 4 – Departure

Episode 3 – The End Mountains

Episode 2 – The Demon Tree

Episode 1 – Underworld

Sword Art Online: Alicization - War of Underworld - Episode 11 (Anime Only)

310 comments · 99% upvoted · other discussions

comments

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[removed]

TheJeep25

I think you forgot the most important thing, Lisbeth's speech

Nero_Lokin

Is eiji and Yuna the mystery person at the end of the episode? After the speech

BleedingUranium

Yeah, they had two quick shots in this episode.

Wgesh8

ordinal scale spoiler: didn't Yuuna "die" at the end of ordinal scale?

BleedingUranium

No, you're getting your characters mixed up. To copy a comment I wrote elsewhere in this thread:

  • Yuuna Shigemura, Eiji's friend trapped in SAO with him.
  • Yuuna the "ghost", the mostly-complete AI copy of Yuuna Shigemura, built from SAO survivors' stolen memories.
  • Yuna the diva, a Yui-style AI created to be the front for Dr. Shigemura and Eiji's plan to harvest memories of Yuuna to rebuild an AI copy of her from those memories. Diva Yuna has absolutely nothing in common with Yuuna Shigemura aside from her physical appearance and voice.

 

  • Yuuna Shigemura died in SAO (specifically covered in Hopeful Chant).
  • Yuuna the "ghost" died at the end of Ordinal Scale, sacrificing herself by breaking up the memories she was made from and sending them back to the people they came from.
  • Yuna the diva was entirely alive and unharmed at the end of Ordinal Scale, but not long after the movie (in Cordial Chords) was being experimented on and nearly died, before being saved by Eiji and Kirito.
Wgesh8

Oh wow thanks for the explanation. I don't think I ever caught that from the movie.

alexj9626

So... the one from this episode was the diva? An AI kinda like Yui?

BleedingUranium

Yeah, have you seen Ordinal Scale?

alexj9626

Yes and read all the novels except for the Ordinal Scale events. Have no idea about it, but almost all Yunas died except YUNA, so is she the one from this episode that looked like a Pixie? If so, how, does she have the memories from old Yuna?

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Chronic_Media

you did your spoiler wrong..

copy and paste this and please correct

[didn't Yuuna "die" at the end of Ordinal Scale?.]+(/spoiler)

remove the "+" between "] (/spoiler)" and it will turn out like this..

didn't Yuuna "die" at the end of Ordinal Scale?.

EDIT: Who downvoted me for trying help this guy fix his spoiler; like really?

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wardota

Speech Art Online

BleedingUranium

The speeches in SAO are some of its best scenes, after all. :D

chrome-disaster

The purple had me hoping it was somehow Zekken...

Kachun92

Was that Eiji and Yuuna? I am hoping to see Lux

Kazaandu

As someone who’s spent most of their adult life playing MMOs, this episode hit a little too close to home.

Dragonaf

ikr!? I'm very close to my mid 20's so I've had the joy of growing up in this golden age of technology development. My earliest memories of MMO's being browser based like Dragon fable, adventure quest and (of course the OG club penguin).

Then in my teens moving on to proper downloaded stuff like Dragonball online, Fiesta, Fly for fun, etc...

And now we're in the world of massive open world hardcore lore games like Warcraft, SWTOR and EVE. Though I've always been a solo player this episode really made me wish I was born in the future and have that actual "alternative life" with other people. I think inception the movie said it best "who are you to question their reality".

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RoachIsCrying

another great episode, Lizbeth's rousing speech rallied the troops, Leafa and Sinon are on their way in, nice seeing a cameo from the Sleeping Knights. Only thing I hated was probably when the Americans started speaking English it was clear that they weren't natural English speakers I felt like that they could've used actual English speaking VAs for that but all in all looking forward to next week's mid-season finale

CannibalPiggy

The VAs sounded better than some of the Asian professors at my University

RoachIsCrying

They sound better than some of my countrymen

[deleted]

Well, you have to “admire” how accreate the portrayal of gamers in America was... I mean, we are obviously fat and obsessed with endless violence...

On a more serious note, the accent was terrible. They should’ve gotten some actual Americans to voice them.

Malroyce

Make no mistake:

Lisbeth was appealing to gamers everywhere, knowing their lives are ultimately surrounded by virtual realities and technology.

That speech made me want to go to hell and back for that cause.

ltgenspartan

I share the same sentiments. This really minded me of Halo 2 on PC. While I don't know if the online part is still going, I know a couple of years ago that it was going to be taken down, so some players stayed logged in indefinitely so it would continue on. People will go a long way to save what they care about, real or not real.

Sharoth01

I felt the same way about City of Heroes. I was there through the end and the final log out. It still hurts.

BZNATC

Yeah, I'm in a virtual squadron in DCS World, and I'm pretty sure in a situation like this we'd all be on the Carrier starting our F-18s to help.

norucus

I feel the same. I’m like, where do I sign up?

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Vindicare605

Yo WTF I did NOT see this episode coming. This is easily my favorite episode of the whole arc.

First off, can they even do that?! I thought the Underworld was built around totally different tech from the Amusphere how would they even be compatible? I suppose if the Americans can do it, it makes sense Yui and Rath would be able to also.

Sinon and Leafa are forming the Vanguard! they're loading into STLs right directly at Rath.

Did Liz's big speech happen in the novel? Because holy shit, I've been waiting 2 and half fucking seasons for my girl to have a big moment again, but this was NOT what I had in mind. I didn't expect her to be the one to rally an army of ALO nerds to come rescue Kirito and Asuna.

When's all said and done, we're gonna get an even bigger team up than what we had in the Ordinal Scale fight inside the Underworld. Now THAT'S what I'm talking about SAO. One of my biggest gripes with the whole Alicization arc was that we left behind the rest of the supporting cast, but if they get to come charging in like the fucking Knights of Rohan at the 11th hour, that's just fine with me.

seitaer13

The Underworld is based on mneumonic data (memories) there's no actual way to observe that without being in an STL. So the Underworld was built with two layers, the main layer of the STL and a bottom layer running on the SEED so they can actually view what's occuring in the Underworld.

So it's possible to dive into the Underworld with an amusphere. In the novel this is actually talked about way back when Alicization was explained to Asuna and Rinko.

StarForceStelar

They can log in with amuspheres but they wont get the realism of it it would look like an ordinary game

[deleted]

So, basically, it won’t be like the butterfly that Kirito saw all the way back in Ep. 2 of Alicization... the part where he said it was way too real to be a 3D object... I wonder where that line lies...

Will things in Underworld just seem slightly uncanny compared to what people in the STL can see?

I know this is a minor plot contrivance, but I want to know...

StarForceStelar

Yes and in the novel when kirito wakes up in underworld he picked a piece of grass and immediately brought it to his face and what he didnt see was that it was untextured so it's like everything was already pre rendered so basically it's like reality where everything looks , feels and tastes exactly the same as it would

[deleted]

So to people who use the Amusphere, things might look glossy, or slightly pixelated... that makes sense.

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StuffedFTW

Yeah Liz's speech happens in the novel.

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CasualAnime

That better be Eiji and Yuna because god damn I can feel his vibe. I wanna see more this badass duo

BleedingUranium

It totally is! And Yuna's a Nav Pixie! :D

Hopefully we'll see additional added cameos as this goes on, like the AGGO crew, or possibly some of the Gameverse characters.

xAltaire

I'd think they're certainly not opposed to it, seeing as how Zeliska and Kureha were hanging out playing billiards in GGO while the main group were explaining plot O:

The-artful-hoxha

I’ve been waiting forever for Lisbeth to get her own big moment in the series. Feeling so vindicated now, that was incredible

BleedingUranium

As someone who's read the novels, I've been waiting for her speech for what feels like forever. And they absolutely nailed it, beautiful acting and cinematography here. <3

The-artful-hoxha

I’ve just finished reading Uniting, got the next 3 books coming in the post in the next day or two. Super excited to get through them now after this!

ma103

As an anime-only, Vector's strategy is genius and total madness to me. It is gonna be a real all-out war. I was wrong to think the dark empire was losing. Now they are back into the game.

Seeing sleeping knights makes me miss Yuuki a little. Getting her to join the war of underworld is equivalent of getting someone of Kirito's caliber which means a huge ass power boost to the human empire.

Lisbeth's speech should hit anyone who played MMOs at least a little. That was deep. Yui's speech hit me a little too.

seitaer13

They weren't losing even without this strategy. The still had a massive numerical advantage, if not for Asuna creating the Ravine the ensuing battle would have gone very badly for the human side.

dmasterxd

The puglists were the only ones who actually proved themselves to be a credible threat though (not counting Gabriel and his friend). Meanwhile pretty much everyone on the human’s side is a major powerhouse...How on Earth would they have lost without the strategy? Quality>Quantity.

seitaer13

The Dark Knights haven't fought yet either, which along with the Pugilists Bercouli acknowledges as the strongest forces in the DT.

Also the integrity knights are incredibly strong due to perfect weapon control. Something that they can only use limited amount of times. Alice was completely unable to use her release without destroying her sword. Bercouli was in the same boat.

They would have had to fight with their swords normally, and would have been overwelmed by the Dark Territories strongest combat units. Vassago's unit would have destroyed the supply corps. The unit escorting Alice would have been completely destroyed without Asuna's intervention.

Ryuuji_Gremory

Everyone on the human's side

I think you counted wrong, the only major power houses are the Integrity Knights (and Asuna), everyone else in the human army are your regular soldier they don't stand a chance in a 1v1 against Dark Knights or Pugilists.

The Integrity Knights have been hard carrying their side for the entirety of the war and eventually their strength will be exhausted and using the perfect weapon control taxes their weapons so they can't hope to just continuously use that, if they do their weapons will eventually break.

AscendedZoom

Damn bro that episode was wild!!! War is about to happen !

TheRavenism

Its definitely happening 🔥🔥

[deleted]

Winter is Comi- Crap. Wrong Subreddit.

Miraidreamerr

Seeing Lisbeth cry in front of everybody, her explaining her troubles, surely brought a tear to my eyes. Not only that, but seeing her touch mostly the elites of the game, and The Sleeping Knights... damn..

deangsana

I started to tear when Yui was explaining how Alice was a culmination of all VRMMO that has existed

[deleted]

Those were a lot of good memories that came flooding back.

KennyTheKoala69

Same😭😭

alexpanzrla

I absolutely loved this episode. I do enjoy the Alicization characters, but the War of Underworld arc barely felt like SAO. Alice is really the protagonist, and without Kirito and the Underworld being so different than Aincrad, it just doesn't feel the same. Not saying that's a negative thing, as I'm loving this arc, and love Alice as the protag, but I did miss the old characters; this was a great episode to remind me that their still around - it made me really nostalgic.

Also, I think this episode perfectly summed up what SAO has always been about: that MMOs are in themselves a reality to the players, and that's okay. I've always seen SAO itself to be the perfect embodiment of an escapist fantasy, which I needed when I watched it the first time; and the show is saying that it's okay to indulge in that sometimes. This episode really brought that theme back that was missing in Alicization, and brought the series full circle. A lot of people would say it's an unhealthy message, but I think that some people just need that sometimes.

I cannot wait to see the whole cast in the Underworld!

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spike021

While I understand what you’re saying I think you kind of miss the point of the story.

The reason the main title is still Sword Art Online is because everything that occurs here results from SAO as the game it was, as well as the technology it introduced to the world. Kirito and the group were really just the agents who brought about the end of the game itself. With Underworld, it’s still roughly a story about SAO and similar ideas (with added AI components), which is why they go through the trouble of explaining stuff about the Seed.

For the story to work it doesn’t have to be Kirito and the others who have 100% of the focus.

dark77638

OH MY GOD! This episode bring back so much memories, so many recollections.

Definitely one of my the best episode of Sword art online.

Sinon and Leafa is descending soon! And everyone make a comeback!

Yui and Lisbeth is taking the stage. So much emotion mixing and filling the episode.

A-1 did their best, clap clap. Hat off to them.

I hope Ray of Light will shine upon Underworld.

[deleted]

What was Sinon doing at 3 am?

OddAndChunky

Sitting on the floor by her bed duh, doesn't everyone do that??

ballfun

thinking about our lord and saviour Jesus Chan

[deleted]

With the lights on? At 3 AM?

ma103

Falling off the bed by the random ring of your phone in the middle of the night

CrimsonKingXIII

Eating a Krabby Patty of course. What else would someone be doing at 3 am?

Frontier246

I saw some books on the floor so I assumed she was reading (although wouldn't have been more comfortable on the bed?).

[deleted]

Novel said she was sleeping so not a big deal but you'd think that the animators would consider the time and place. Makes it seem like Sinon has a case of insomnia or something to be up at 3 am.

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thegreykane

Sword Art Online: Endgame

yoruichirukiaisbae

Lisbeth is best girl.
Who is the cloaked individual that appears in the hall towards the end of Lisbeth's speech?

_Mayama_

Pretty sure that's Eiji and Yuna from the movie Ordinal Scale. Pixie has white hair and hooded guy has matching bangs with Eiji.

BleedingUranium

Yuna as a Navigation Pixie is amazing, I hope she manages to get into UW too. <3

 

Given this, everyone should read the Cordial Chords short story. It's an epilogue to Ordinal Scale, and involves Kirito and Eiji working together to save Yuna, you can read it here.

Cordial Chords is itself a sequel to the Hopeful Chant short story; Hopeful Chant is the story of Nautilus/Eiji and Yuuna in SAO, and Yuuna's death. You can read it here, and elements of it are important to Cordial Chords.

Laxus2398

I think the same as you, I just came here to say i think it´s eiji and the pixie is yuna. As you said i searh a picture of him on the internet and length of the hair and the color matches as well

Vyper1126

Seriously who is she, she even has a fairy of her own

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OddAndChunky

So pumped for next week. This isn't looking particularly good for all our friends in the anime but we all know they're gonna bust out some OP shit and win the war.

n0oDle13

Kirito is the op shit

bomb2chest

Dark territory: We have a 100k troops

Human territory: We have a Kirito

deangsana

That's my secret, I'm always OP

wakes up from coma

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theTimothy_

Goosebumps Simulator

Captain-Baka

Wow. This season is doing an absolute amazing job of making you feel bad about the dark territory. Almost shed tears at Iskahn so worried about his soldiers.

One extremely big problem I had with this episode though is that I thought the Underworld could only be experienced by special fluctlight equipment the STL. Why is that people can enter it through their homes through commercial NerveGear AmuSphere? Doesn't make sense. Especially if the NerveGear AmuSphere has consumer safety protocols like pain absorption and failsafe logouts as previously described in the past.

Everything else seems believeable though.

Edit: Getting a lot of the same replies saying that users can access the Underworld via AmuSphere, albiet at a diminished state. Thanks. But it's still extremely disappointing that, up until now, the STL and UW were hyped up as next-generation tech/environment that is super secured in a manmade fortress and being warred against by real life governments.. and then just to have the anime say "oh yeah any motherfucker from home could have accessed it all along." I get that being able to do system call and incarnations are important, and a big reason why the real life harem would go with STL over AS, but this is not explained AT ALL in todays episode.

SKStacia

Remember that the initial environment was made using The Seed. That means, in theory, and now in practice, those with AmuSpheres can log in. That is, Underworld is a dual-level construct, having both the Mnemonic Visual existence for its inhabitants and those who log in via STL, but also a polygonal model, allowing those with standard FullDive apparatus to enter as well.

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likith101

Oh My God, this is the most hyped I've been in a very long time.

MigNuggets

Obviously other than Lisbeth’s incredible speech, did anybody get chills from Yui observing all the Americans logging in and knew she had to do something? Love her

BleedingUranium

Yep, Yui and Liz are two of my absolute favourites, so naturally I love this episode to bits.

HappyGraviel

YUNA IS COMING OMG YES!

[deleted]

Ok, was I the o my person that noticed the pugilist leader's eye at around 6:20-6:25? There was an audio cue and the camera held onto his face for a bit longer than usual as well as his RIGHT eye turning a more intense shade of red. I haven't seen anyone bring this up but this could be a big turning point for his character. And given the context and how much he seems to be annoyed at the fact his people are dying seemingly for nothing, I'm expecting a change of heart from him soon.

Sentinel-Wraith

Ok, so some major issues with this episode.

Why is the Japan vs. US theme being pushed so hard? They could easily create another Beta for a defending team and American players would flock to defend the golden waifu over the dark edgelord. PVP is huge in America, so that's very odd they can't think to do that, especially as the Beta testers aren't aware it's connected to a spy op?

Secondly, why does Yui only have the Japanese players to oppose the hordes of American player? Do Koreans, Chinese, Russians, Philippines and other not also have legions of gamers that play late into the night? Or do they not count as they aren't Japanese? I'm living in Japan and even at 4am gaming with things like Monster Hunter... If I fire an SOS I get flooded with Chinese and Korean players coming to help in seconds.

Third, why doesn't this blow up? The Japanese development of offensive AI and the US attack on a Japanese research facility in peacetime would be an utterly humiliating incident and force an immediate halt of hostilities. Both countries are in the wrong as Alice violates Article 9 of the Japanese Constitution and the apparent American attack on an ally housing US Troops would be a serious threat to American military strategy.

Forth, do they really think violence alone would immediately attract 20,000 players for a game nobody ever heard of IN THE MIDDLE OF THE DAY? Especially when GGO and other games have flooded the American market?

Fifth... the stereotypes and terrible engrish were pretty awful. It's pretty clear the author is a nationalist with a chip on his shoulder. Not only by forcing an American vs. Japanese fight when both countries are actually very close allies, but by also intentionally excluding other regional gamers from helping Japan.

seitaer13

This was written in the mid 2000's, at the height of anti-american sentiment abroad due to the war in Iraq. In this Universe Japan and America are in an arms race over military applications of Full dive tech. They are allies in this universe, but not nearly as close as they are in ours. Rath's project would completely change the balance of military power in the world and the ways wars were fought.

Minor LN spoiler concerning Korean and Chinese players At the time of writing there was serious tension between Japanese MMO gamers and Chinese and Korean players. Japan was evidently actively pushing foreign players out of their games at the time according to Kawahara in the volume 17 afterward.

Japanese Higher ups allowed the attack on Ocean turtle, the ordered their escort ship away and won't help til a certain time period allowing the assault team to act with impunity.

As for the American players (another minor LN spoiler). In Universe currently America has strict regulations on what can be shown in their games. A fully realistic game where there's actual blood where you can PvP all you want is not something most American players have ever played. So one appears and they can even play it for free of course you're going to get a lot of players especially in the middle of the day.

CrimsunA

Seeing Eiji just made my whole week

Chronic_Media

Let me ask you guys..

In this scenario, would you have joined Lizbeth & journey'd into The Underworld, without a Pain Absorber?

Be honest, I can't really say I would.. I'd be terrified pf possibly dying from the pain itself.

KleinBestGirl

I'd follow Klein, blessed be his name, through the gates of hell

Chronic_Media

uhh..

Username checks out?

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JerichLevan

If i can only sleep 1 week,so when i woke up i can watch the latest episode of sao.Tbh every episode of sao is worth waiting

[deleted]

What a rollercoaster. Lisbeth speaking straight fax.

Kisara-Foxfire

While I am super stoked to hear Lisbeths speech to rally the Japan gamers. I want to say our precious Nav pixie AI Yui is truly the best supporting character ever. At this point its totally overlooked but shes not only manipulating the real world by getting people places and Taxi services but also doing everything she can to save her mommy and daddy <3

Ontariel12

Okay, this was amazing. Can't wait to see their faces when all the good guys appear

Mystic_Arts

It feels like there's going to be a break after this episode....I really hope not cuz I need my fix

BleedingUranium

One more before the break.

HappyGraviel

Theres a long hiatus after next week, the second part comes out next Spring

garethjie87

But can we appreciate Lisbeth VO! Definitely i can feel the emotion!

[deleted]

That was a fucking amazing episode

SUM_SHADOW

This episode left me speechless. I honestly can't wait for next week's episode! 👏

[deleted]

Ok, so it seems like not a lot of people are talking about a couple points:

  1. The pugilist leader's right eye flashed a different color of red, signifying he's having deviant thoughts against the dark territory's set of parameters which is to PROTECT the dark territory. Meaning, he's potentially thinking about rebelling against this war to try and save his people. Maybe we'll see an alliance switch?? :D

  2. Liz said you have to die IN GAME in order to log out which is another opposite, so-to-speak, like my above point of the Seal of the Right eye working on the opposing forces. It's a clever plot point flipping the whole "if you die in-game you die in real life" into "if you die in-game you log out/live in real life."

I love all the parallels and symbolism in this episode. Also everyone's convinced it's Yuna and Eiji...I guess I'll be watching Ordinal Scale again between now and next weekend 😆

BleedingUranium

The pugilist leader's right eye flashed a different color of red, signifying he's having deviant thoughts against the dark territory's set of parameters which is to PROTECT the dark territory.

Close, and you're absolutely correct in theme and concept, but the rule is actually slightly different than that. Unlike the Human Empire and its Taboo Index filled with many laws, the Dark Territory has only one true law: The strong must be obeyed. Or, you must obey those stronger than you (same difference).

Seeing as Vector demonstrated he is the strongest when he defeated General Shasta, the rule they have to try to defy is to defy Vector.

 

Yeah, that's a neat flip of how Aincrad worked. You can only log out if you die, but there's also pain, which didn't exist there.

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